The Rest Is History
The Rest Is History

168. Oil: Conflict, Chaos and Climate Change

Tom and Dominic are back with Helen Thompson for a second episode on the history of oil, its impact and how it shapes geopolitics. Tune in to hear about the impact of oil production on US Politics, its importance to the history and current situation in Ukraine, and what we can learn about oil from t

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Helen Thompson Guest

Topics Discussed

Episode Summary

Executive Summary: Helen Thompson argues that oil has shaped geopolitics not just in authoritarian petrostates but also in democracies like the U.S. and Europe. The discussion links Texas, Dallas, the Gulf Wars, Russia, Ukraine, China, and climate policy to energy dependence, showing that oil and gas remain central to power, even as green energy creates a second, overlapping geopolitical order.

Main Topics: Oil and American politics (Priority: 5/5): Thompson argues that U.S. oil production influenced democratic politics, especially through Texas’s rise and the political power of oil money and lobbying. Dallas as oil mythology (Priority: 4/5): The TV series Dallas is read as a cultural allegory for U.S. oil politics: old-style independence, the need to drill abroad, and the sacrifices required to sustain energy power. Gulf Wars and oil strategy (Priority: 5/5): The first Gulf War is presented as openly tied to oil interests, while the second Iraq War is framed as partly driven by concerns over future supply, sanctions, and access to production. Europe, dependency, and hypocrisy (Priority: 5/5): European states lacked domestic oil and gas, making them dependent on U.S. power and later on Russian energy, while also pushing alternative energy and moral criticism of fossil fuels. Russia, Ukraine, and pipeline geopolitics (Priority: 5/5): Ukraine is central because pipelines through its territory have long been strategic. Nord Stream and TurkStream are portrayed as efforts to bypass Ukraine and reshape European energy dependence. China, India, and the future energy order (Priority: 4/5): Asia’s rising demand, especially China and India, is said to be as important as Europe in energy geopolitics, with China also advantaged in green-energy supply chains and critical minerals. Energy transition and persistent fossil-fuel dependence (Priority: 5/5): Thompson argues that net zero will be difficult on current technology, and that green energy will likely grow without fully displacing oil and gas, producing a multi-energy world.

Key Arguments: Oil can distort politics even in democracies; the U.S. case shows that oil wealth, lobbying, and regional power shifts can reshape national politics without creating a petrostate. Texas’s rise in the 20th century, especially after the 1930 East Texas oil discovery, helped produce major political figures and shifted American political influence westward. Dallas functions as a symbolic story about oil: J.R. Ewing embodies the hard, often morally compromised choices needed to keep American oil power alive in the late 1970s. The first Gulf War was explicitly about protecting Western oil interests in Kuwait; the second Iraq War had a serious oil context even if it was not reducible to oil alone. Europe’s lack of domestic oil and gas made it dependent on external suppliers and encouraged both moral criticism of fossil fuels and practical reliance on them. German energy policy, especially under Schröder and Nord Stream, reflected strategic indifference to Ukraine’s role and deepened dependence on Russian gas. Ukraine is a key transit state in the history of European oil and gas, and pipeline routes through or around it have been central to great-power competition. China’s rise changes energy geopolitics because it increases demand for oil and gas while also dominating parts of the green-energy manufacturing and mineral supply chain. The energy transition will not simply replace fossil fuels; instead, fossil fuels and green energy will coexist, making geopolitics more complex rather than less. High energy prices are driven by fossil-fuel supply and demand dynamics, not simply by climate policy or the push toward net zero.

Data Points: Year: 1930 - Discovery of the East Texas oil field, described as the largest oil field ever found at the time. Time period: 1930s - Rise of Texas’s influence in American politics during the Depression and New Deal era. Time period: 1950s-1970s - Peak era of oil lobby influence in Washington, described as unrivaled by other lobby groups. Year: 2016 - Oil and gas industry heavily funded Jeb Bush’s presidential run, but he failed to gain traction. Year: 1978 - Dallas began during the U.S. energy crisis and reflected oil politics of the period. Year: 1993 - China stopped being self-sufficient in oil. Year: 2000 - European concern about Russian gas dependency was already visible around this time. Year: 2005 - Schröder’s government agreed to the first Nord Stream pipeline with Russia in its final weeks. Year: 2015 - Putin secured agreement for TurkStream, aiming to bypass Ukraine for gas exports to Europe. Year: 2050 - Net zero target discussed as relying on technologies that do not yet exist at scale.

Pivotal Quotes: "I think the really interesting case here is the United States." — Helen Thompson: Opening response to the idea that oil is a curse, shifting the discussion from petrostates to democratic politics. "JR is kind of like doing the unpalatable things all the time that are necessary for America in the symbolism, Ewing Oil, to survive in this world" — Helen Thompson: Interpretation of Dallas as an allegory for U.S. oil dependence and geopolitical compromise. "we're going to have an even more geopolitically complicated world because we're going to have the old geopolitics and the new geopolitics happening at the same time" — Helen Thompson: Summary of her view on the coexistence of fossil-fuel geopolitics and green-energy geopolitics.

Implications: Listeners should expect oil and gas to remain central to world politics for decades, even amid climate policy. The future is likely a multi-energy system with persistent geopolitical rivalry over pipelines, LNG, and critical minerals.

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About The Rest Is History

Take a deep dive into History’s biggest moments with Tom Holland & Dominic Sandbrook. Explore the stories of History’s most brutal rulers, deadly battles, and world-changing events. From the rise and fall of the Roman Empire, the Nazi conquest of Europe, and Hitler’s evil master plan for world domination, to the French Revolution, the sinking of the Titanic, or the Norman Conquest of England in 1066, Tom and Dominic bring the past to life with gripping storytelling and expert analysis, as they unpack the high-drama moments that shaped our world. Join The Rest Is History Club: Unlock the full experience of the show – with exclusive bonus episodes, ad-free listening, early access to every series and live show tickets, a members-only newsletter, discounted books from the show, and access to our private Discord chatroom. Sign up directly at therestishistory.com. For more Goalhanger Podcasts, head to www.goalhanger.com.

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