Ep186: Bruce Levine & Mags McCarthy on a Song About Science and Hope

Episode Summary

Executive Summary: This episode of The Long Run features an unlikely collaboration between CAR T cell therapy pioneer Bruce Levine and Irish country music star Mags McCarthy. They co-wrote the song "Ring That Bell" to raise awareness about CAR T cell immunotherapy and bring hope to cancer patients. The conversation explores their backgrounds, how they met after Mags reached out for help with a family member's cancer diagnosis, the creative process of making the song scientifically accurate yet emotionally resonant, and the impact it has had on patients and the broader community. They discuss the importance of bridging science and the arts to communicate hope and advance medical progress.

Main Topics: Unlikely Collaboration Between Science and Music (Priority: 5/5): Bruce Levine, a CAR T cell therapy scientist, and Mags McCarthy, a country musician, met after Mags emailed Bruce for help with a family member's cancer diagnosis. Their friendship evolved into a creative partnership to write a song about CAR T cell therapy. The Song 'Ring That Bell' and Its Symbolism (Priority: 5/5): The song is named after the tradition of cancer patients ringing a bell to mark treatment milestones. It aims to convey hope, gratitude, and the human spirit's triumph over adversity, while educating listeners about CAR T cell immunotherapy. Bridging the Gap Between Science and the Public (Priority: 4/5): Bruce discusses the historical divide between science and the humanities, emphasizing the need for scientists to communicate their work effectively to gain public support and funding. The song serves as a tool for public education. Personal Impact of Cancer and Immunotherapy (Priority: 4/5): Mags shares her personal experience with a family member's blood cancer diagnosis, which motivated her to research CAR T cells and reach out to Bruce. The song is a tribute to patients and clinical trial participants. Creative Process and Challenges (Priority: 3/5): The collaboration involved multiple revisions to balance scientific accuracy with musicality. The video featured real patient photos, requiring careful legal and emotional considerations. Distribution and Outreach Strategy (Priority: 3/5): The song was released through Mags' independent label, became an Amazon bestseller, and is being promoted via a public service announcement campaign to country, gospel, and Christian radio stations across the U.S.

Key Arguments: Scientists must communicate their work to the public to secure funding and support, as highlighted by the historical divide between science and the humanities. CAR T cell therapy offers genuine hope for cancer patients, but awareness among patients and oncologists is limited, hindering access. Music and art can effectively convey the emotional and human aspects of scientific advances, making them more accessible and resonant. Clinical trial enrollment is critical for advancing medicine, and raising awareness through creative projects can accelerate progress. The song 'Ring That Bell' is a tribute to patients and their families, emphasizing gratitude and the importance of hope. The collaboration was independent, without financial support from pharmaceutical companies, ensuring authenticity.

Data Points: Time from diagnosis to email: Two days - Mags emailed Bruce two days after her family member's cancer diagnosis. Song release date: May 2nd - The song was released on May 2nd, after recording at Windmill Lane Studios on August 8th the previous year. Patient's stem cell transplant date: June 7th, 2022 - Mags' family member underwent a stem cell transplant on this date and is now over three years post-transplant. Amazon bestseller status: Multiple days - The song became an Amazon bestseller, appearing alongside major artists like Morgan Wallen and Lady Gaga. Number of patient photos in video: 15-20 - Bruce recruited 15-20 patients or families to contribute photos for the music video.

Pivotal Quotes: "I don't think you could ever put a price on someone's life. And, you know, if a patient needs something, no matter what, I think they should be given the opportunity to live and to survive and worry about the money afterwards." — Mags McCarthy: Mags responds to a question about the cost of CAR T therapy, emphasizing the value of life over financial concerns. "We have to do a much better job at communicating. Indicating what we're doing." — Bruce Levine: Bruce discusses the importance of science communication to gain public support and funding for research. "Every time I watch that video, it affects me. You know, I, and I'll be saying to Bruce, you know, I remember Bruce, remember one night, I was questioning. You and just about, you know, you've been wondering, I suppose, you know, as I suppose, from a doctor, scientific, you know, could they have done better?" — Mags McCarthy: Mags reflects on the emotional impact of the video, which includes a patient who did not survive, and her ongoing questions about treatment outcomes.

Implications: This collaboration demonstrates the power of art to humanize science and inspire hope. It encourages scientists to engage in creative outreach, potentially increasing clinical trial enrollment and public support for immunotherapy. The model could be replicated for other medical advances.