Episode Summary
Executive Summary: Robert Kaplan argued the Fed’s December decision is unusually difficult because labor-market weakness may be cyclical, structural, or temporary, while inflation remains above target and tariffs may still feed through in 2026. He said the market is too confident about multiple cuts, expects the Fed to stay data- and risk-management-driven, and sees Fed independence concerns rising but not yet driving policy.
Main Topics: December Fed rate decision is a close call (Priority: 5/5): Kaplan said the probability of a December cut looked too high before the October meeting and that Powell’s hawkish tone appropriately broadened the debate. He sees the decision as a game-time call with legitimate arguments on both sides. Labor market weakness and its causes (Priority: 5/5): He described hiring as near stall speed but said weakness may reflect tariffs, tighter immigration/provisional-status labor supply, and the shutdown rather than a purely cyclical slowdown. Inflation remains sticky and tariff pass-through may still come (Priority: 5/5): Kaplan argued inflation is still well above the Fed’s goal and that many companies may only begin fully passing tariff-related costs through in 2026, especially in services. Policy is complicated by missing government data (Priority: 4/5): The shutdown created a data vacuum, forcing the Fed to rely more on anecdotes and private sources rather than the models and comprehensive data it prefers. Neutral rate and risk management favor caution (Priority: 5/5): He said the Fed is close to neutral while inflation is still above target, which makes additional cuts riskier unless the labor market worsens materially or inflation improves more clearly. Fed independence and future leadership (Priority: 4/5): Kaplan said political pressure has had only marginal effect so far, but investor concerns about Fed independence are rising. He expects independence in monetary policy to remain strong unless personnel changes become substantial. What to watch into 2026 (Priority: 3/5): He will monitor post-shutdown weakness, consumer and business spending, and whether costs and prices in goods and services show more inflation pass-through.
Key Arguments: Kaplan believes the market is overpricing the odds of near-term and 2026 rate cuts because he does not see enough evidence of either severe labor-market deterioration or clear inflation progress to justify aggressive easing. He argues the labor market’s weakness may be partly non-cyclical, driven by tariffs, immigration-related labor-supply disruption, and matching problems, which monetary policy cannot fully fix. He says many firms are absorbing tariff costs in margins for now, but small businesses are more exposed and tariff effects may show up more visibly in 2026. He contends the shutdown worsened growth and obscured the Fed’s read on the economy by removing key official data, forcing reliance on anecdotes and private indicators. He frames the Fed’s dilemma as a risk-management problem: cutting in December could leave policy too loose if labor stabilizes and inflation stays sticky; skipping a cut risks being behind the curve if labor weakens further. He suggests Fed independence in setting rates remains culturally strong, though concerns among global investors are growing and may be reflected in asset prices like gold. He thinks regulation is less politically independent than monetary policy and could see changes in balance-sheet management under new Fed leadership, including more discussion of extending duration.
Data Points: Inflation vs target: 2.25% to 3% - Kaplan said inflation remains above the Fed’s 2% goal, making further cuts harder to justify. Neutral real Fed funds rate: 0.75% to 1% - He cited broad consensus that the real neutral rate is roughly three-quarters to one percent. Implied nominal neutral rate: About 3.5% to 3.75% - Kaplan estimated the nominal neutral policy rate using current inflation above target. Current Fed funds rate range: 3.25% to 4% - He said the Fed is already near neutral, increasing caution about more cuts. Labor market assessment: Hiring is at stall speed - Kaplan described the labor market as weak but not clearly collapsing. Shutdown duration: Longest shutdown on record - He said the government shutdown ended after a record-length disruption and created a data vacuum. Immigration-related workforce estimate: 12 to 15 million workers - He referenced workers on provisional status who make up a large share of construction, agriculture, and services. Tariff pass-through timing: More impact in 2026 - Kaplan said many businesses expect tariff-related price effects to appear later, not fully yet. Goods disinflation trend: Interrupted - He said tariffs have interrupted prior goods disinflation, contributing to inflation staying sideways. Gold rally: 50% plus - He suggested rising concern about Fed independence may be one factor behind gold’s strong rally.
Pivotal Quotes: "The honest answer is: I don't know." — Robert Kaplan: On whether the labor-market weakness is cyclical or structural and how much policy can address it. "Do you really want to be at neutral with inflation running this much above target?" — Robert Kaplan: On why he thinks the Fed should be cautious about further cuts. "I think the market is overestimating the probability of rate cuts." — Robert Kaplan: On market expectations for December and 2026 easing.
Implications: Listeners should expect a more cautious Fed than markets assume, with December and 2026 cuts dependent on clearer labor weakness or faster disinflation. Businesses should prepare for delayed tariff pass-through and continued policy uncertainty.
About Goldman Sachs Exchanges
In each episode of "Exchanges," people from the firm share their insights on developments shaping industries, markets and the global economy.