The Honey Lawsuit Was Dismissed - WAN Show November 28, 2025

Episode Summary

Executive Summary: The episode centered on the dismissed Honey influencer lawsuit and what it says about proving digital damages, affiliate attribution, and sponsor ethics. It also covered Black Friday/LTT Store promos, longer device replacement cycles, GrapheneOS relocating away from France, AI jailbreaks via poetry, foreign influence on X, Meta’s alleged moderation failures, and several tech/market updates spanning phones, GPUs, Linux, and AI.

Main Topics: Honey lawsuit dismissal and affiliate attribution (Priority: 5/5): The hosts unpacked the dismissal of the creators’ class action against Honey/PayPal, debating why proving monetary loss in digital affiliate systems is difficult and whether the case can be revised within 45 days. Black Friday/Cyber Monday LTT Store promotion (Priority: 5/5): A major portion of the show was devoted to selling seasonal LTT Store deals, free shipping thresholds, bundles, and new product launches including the black Scribe Driver pen/pencil and Floatplane-exclusive merch. Tech longevity and replacement cycles (Priority: 4/5): The conversation argued that consumers are keeping phones and laptops longer because modern devices are good enough, with a critique of claims that aging devices are broadly harming the economy. AI safety, utility, and abuse (Priority: 4/5): The hosts discussed adversarial poetry jailbreaks, concerns about AI-generated misinformation and cheating, and the broader tension between genuine productivity gains and bad uses of AI. Privacy, censorship, and platform policy (Priority: 4/5): GrapheneOS leaving France, Meta’s alleged 17-strike sex-trafficking policy, and app-store age verification were examined as examples of governments and platforms shaping digital rights and moderation. Market and hardware updates (Priority: 3/5): There were rapid-fire updates on Intel Panther Lake rumors, Arc B580 pricing, RAM inflation, Apple memory pricing, and the growing attractiveness of devices that already work well enough. Social/media manipulation and product ecosystem friction (Priority: 3/5): The hosts discussed X showing account locations and the prevalence of foreign political influence, plus concerns about car infotainment ads, locked-down ecosystems, and the future of online platforms.

Key Arguments: Digital affiliate and advertising disputes are hard to litigate because losses are highly dynamic and often theoretical rather than directly measurable. Honey changed LMG’s sponsor scrutiny by making them more cautious about terms of service, attribution, and hidden conflicts of interest. Many consumers now replace phones and laptops only when functionality breaks down, not for novelty, because modern devices last longer and are already good enough. AI is useful for research, categorization, and speeding up work, but its output must be checked because errors, cheating, and misuse can outweigh productivity gains. Open privacy/security tools like GrapheneOS can be used by criminals, but that does not justify restricting ordinary users’ rights and privacy protections. Social platforms and governments often overreact by using broad moderation or policy tools that can harm legitimate users while trying to target bad actors. Brands that work well with creators build value beyond money when they accept criticism, fix issues, and maintain transparency. Hardware buying decisions are being distorted by RAM/storage inflation and supply-chain uncertainty, making some “good enough” products unusually attractive.

Data Points: Honey lawsuit status: dismissed, with 45 days to amend - US federal judge dismissed creators’ class action but allowed an amended complaint window Average US phone replacement time: 2 years and 5 months longer than the 22-month benchmark - Reviews.org/ CNBC discussion of Americans holding phones longer Average phone price paid by Americans: $634.35 - Survey figure cited in the device-longevity segment Business productivity decline from delayed equipment replacement: about 1/3 of 1% per extra year - Federal Reserve data cited by CNBC Honey lawsuit damages theory: hypothetical chain of possibilities - Judge’s reason for dismissing the claim as presented Honey discussion window: 45 days - Creators were given time to revise arguments Adversarial poetry jailbreak success rate: 62% handcrafted, 43% automated poems - Study on AI safety guardrail bypasses Gemini 2.5 Pro failure rate on handcrafted poems: 100% - Model vulnerability in the poetry jailbreak study GPT-5 variant failure rate: up to 5% - More resistant but still vulnerable in the poetry jailbreak study GrapheneOS server migration: from 1 active French-located server and 15 OVH-hosted servers to 5 OVH machines in Quebec - Project’s move away from France after state pressure LTT Store free shipping threshold: $100 USD / $100 CAD - Black Friday/Cyber Monday promotion threshold LTT Store bundle savings: up to $50 - Precision screwdriver and TechSac bundle offer Black Scribe Driver coating: PVD coating - New black pen/pencil version described as more scratch-resistant Arc B580 price: $249.99 USD MSRP - MSRP check-in for Intel Arc B580 B580 Canadian pricing example: $359 CAD with game bundle - Canadian retailer pricing with qualifying games Apple Mac mini starting price: $599 - Example of Apple’s attractive starting configuration with 16GB unified memory Meta moderation claim: 17 strikes - Court filing alleges sex-trafficking-related violations could accumulate to 16 before suspension on the 17th Zorin OS downloads: over 1 million in 5 weeks - Reported surge ahead of Windows 10 retirement Zorin OS Windows-origin share: 78% - Developers claim most downloads came from Windows systems

Pivotal Quotes: "the plaintiffs failed to demonstrate that they actually lost any money, relying on what Judge Beth Freeman called a hypothetical chain of possibilities" — Host narration: Explaining why the Honey lawsuit was dismissed "You have to own your output" — Linus: On AI-generated content, internal review, and responsibility for published work "Floattplane, Firefox, Fentanyl" — Linus: A joking aside during a discussion of privacy tools, platform behavior, and criminal associations

Implications: Expect tighter scrutiny of affiliate, moderation, and AI systems, with more emphasis on measurable harm and human review. For consumers, longevity and repairability look increasingly rational as hardware improves and pricing remains volatile.