Episode Summary
Executive Summary: Psychologist Erin Westgate explains boredom as a real emotion signaling low meaningful engagement or attention, not mere inactivity. The episode explores why boredom rises in confinement, how it differs from depression, its links to phones, intelligence, categorization, and procrastination, and offers practical ways to reduce boredom by increasing meaning, adjusting task difficulty, and listening to emotional signals.
Main Topics: Boredom as an emotion, not emptiness: Westgate defines boredom as an emotional state that occurs when people cannot engage meaningfully—either because attention fails or the activity lacks meaning. Boredom during COVID-19 confinement: The conversation frames the pandemic as a natural boredom trigger because routines, freedom, and social outlets were suddenly restricted. Boredom’s function and risks: Boredom is compared to pain: it is unpleasant but useful as a signal that something is wrong and needs change; it becomes harmful when no good alternative is available. Boredom, depression, and self-regulation: The episode examines how boredom overlaps with depression and maladaptive behaviors like substance use, while emphasizing that causal direction remains unclear. Technology, intelligence, and boredom susceptibility: Westgate discusses possible relationships between smartphone use, daydreaming, IQ, and boredom, highlighting small correlations but unclear causality. Meaning-making through categorization: Activities like birding and collecting are presented as ways categorization creates order, coherence, and meaning, thereby reducing boredom and increasing interest. Productive procrastination and practical coping: Westgate distinguishes unproductive avoidance from productive procrastination, arguing that doing other valuable tasks can be an acceptable coping strategy.
Key Arguments: Boredom is best understood as an emotion indicating that one cannot engage meaningfully with the present activity. During COVID-19, boredom increased for many people because routines, freedom, and distractions were reduced, though some people felt more overwhelmed than bored. Boredom is adaptive when it motivates people to fix a problem, but it becomes maladaptive when no better options are available. The relationship between boredom and depression is complicated; they overlap in symptoms and may reinforce each other, but causality is not settled. Brain scans are not yet reliable for distinguishing specific emotions like boredom from other high-arousal states, so self-report remains central. Phone use may relate to difficulty enjoying one’s own thoughts, but evidence is correlational and does not establish causation. Higher IQ may help in some boredom contexts but may increase boredom in monotonous tasks because of a larger gap between available mental resources and task demands. Categorization creates patterns and coherence, which people experience as meaning; meaningfulness reduces boredom. Productive procrastination is common and may not harm academic performance or increase risk in the same way as classic leisure-based procrastination. Effective coping with boredom or procrastination often involves identifying whether the task feels too hard, too easy, too meaningless, or too high-stakes, then adjusting focus accordingly.
Data Points: Men who chose self-shock in boredom study: 67% - In a lab task where participants could think quietly or shock themselves, 67% of men chose the shock option. Women who chose self-shock in boredom study: 25% - In the same lab task, 25% of women chose to shock themselves instead of sitting with their thoughts. Participant willing to shock repeatedly: Over 75 times - One participant was excluded for shocking himself more than 75 times during the short session. Shock task duration: 15-20 minutes - The repeated self-shocking occurred within a brief experimental period. Money participants would pay to avoid shock: About $2 - After experiencing the shock, participants said they would pay on average about $2 not to be shocked again, despite the option of $5. Italy quarantine downside ranking: Second biggest downside was boredom - Italian quarantine research cited by Westgate found boredom ranked second behind lack of freedom, ahead of loneliness and social isolation. Correlation between phone use and boredom in daydreaming: Very small but significant - Research cited suggests heavier cell phone use is associated with slightly greater difficulty enjoying one’s own thoughts. Social media abstinence period: A couple of weeks - Westgate referenced a study where people were paid not to use social media for a few weeks, improving happiness and well-being. College GPA finding for productive procrastination: No meaningful difference - People engaging in productive procrastination did not differ in college GPA from those who did not procrastinate. Procrastination prevalence among people who do not procrastinate: 25-40% - Westgate noted that depending on the study, a substantial share of people report not procrastinating at all.
Pivotal Quotes: "boredom is actually an emotion like any other you experience, like anger or sadness" — Erin Westgate: Definition of boredom early in the interview "Boredom is like pain. No one wants to experience pain...but it's also really, really useful" — Erin Westgate: Explaining boredom’s adaptive function as a signal "the only boring people are boring or only boring people get bored" — Erin Westgate: Discussing stereotypes about boring people and whether people are responsible for being boring
Implications: Listeners can treat boredom as information, not failure. By increasing meaning, matching task difficulty, and using productive procrastination strategically, people may reduce boredom and improve motivation, especially during confinement or routine-heavy periods.